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tv   Mad Money  CNBC  November 12, 2012 11:00pm-12:00am EST

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for a body in motion. > i'm jim cramer and welcome to my world. >> you need to get in the game! >> firms are going to go out of business and he's nuts! they're nuts! they know nothing. >> i like to say there is a bull market somewhere. "mad money," you can't afford to miss it. hey, i'm cramer. welcome to "mad money." welcome to cramerica. other people want to make friends. i'm just trying to save you some money. my job is not just to entertain you but educate you. so call me at 1-800-743-cnbc. this fiscal cliff stuff is driving me crazy! because our stock market couldn't rally on anything that averts the crisis. every day we get evidence of what could happen if washington would just get off our backs! sell, sell, sell. >> the house of pain! >> sure that evidence is often
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obscured by the averages like today where they meandered all session. dow closing flat. nasdaq down slightly. but that doesn't stop us from looking for ideas on "mad money." yes, we have an entirely man made crisis. one that could not only cause a huge wave of firings and curtail retail spending dramatically, but it's also driving people out of a stock market where individual companies are giving you positives that would normally provide a tremendous backdrop to a higher market. you know there was a time when some good news over multiple sectors would produce a bountiful bull. yes, where enough good things occurred with individual companies that the sum total would produce overall gains in many stocks. we used to call this pin action. now we get nothing. no spillover. the one pin gets knocked down. and nothing else falls with it.
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let me just go over some of the good news, some of the knocked down one pins just today that are being obscured by this darn cliff walk. let me show you what you might have missed and will continue to miss until president obama convenes all the leaders of congress and sends them to camp david to hammer out an agreement in time for the holidays. don't you leave camp david unless you have an agreement. there are three ways to win today. they're all beautiful. three ways that would have been available for you if you followed the show this year. i know that many of you have just decided that until the cliff's bridged or we plunge down it, you simply aren't interested in even attempting to make money. you just don't want to lose money. even a known bad is better than an unknown anything which is where we are right now. i spend a huge amount of time on this show talking about biotech stocks.
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i embrace speculating in the biotech sector at every turn. today we saw two terrific reasons why this makes sense, the sale of two stocks, celgene and gilead. perhaps the most recommended names on this show in 2012 right from the beginning of the year. we tried to draw your attention to the dreaded disease that is hepatitis c and how one company, gilead, is working on a breakthrough treatment. this weekend gilead showed some results at a conference that astonished people. a drug that cleared hep-c virus. that's remarkable. current drugs only work about 50% of the time. it's why the stock traded to a 20-year high. it rallied $8.91 or 13.7%. but, of course, the fiscal cliff probably kept you from being involved in that one. this weekend we also heard news from celgene that the drug abraxin showed positive results against pancreatic cancer. one that there is very little hope for. celgene is up 5.82%.
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it was up more at one point. what i think is most important, more important than this news is the fact that back in august celgene's ceo stood right here and predicted that we hear good things about the drug in the fall. again, this is like gilead, a totally gettable piece of information. it was brought to you right on the show. i bet most of you didn't take advantage of it because the situation in washington so clouds everyone's judgment, creates horrendous climate of investing fear that i know i feel, i know i feel for my charitable trust. oh, man. don't kill us. but if biotech is too ethereal for you, how about paint? we stood by when sherwin williams but even we, meaning me, didn't see this purchase of mexican paint maker colmex coming in a deal that immediately added to earnings. sherwin williams by buying a company soared $8.22.
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5.84%. and sherwin williams is not the only acquirer to see its share price jump. the company has been hanging around for years doing nothing, kind of a dog, of course it jumped $4.93 to close at $16.50. you know what i think is more important? the gains that they gave shareholders simply by buying another company. they took advantage of lower prices of all stocks, pounced and made you a ton of money for doing so. how hard is it to find these deals? maybe not as hard as it would seem. last week we saw a deal for a boutique investment house that gave you a nice gain. should we be surprised that jeffries group gave you a 14% win this single session by being bought? i think they're all in the same course. the course that says stocks are
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overall are simply too cheap even as on any given day we focus on the averages to gain any ground. last week's horrendous losses being the prime example of what i'm talking about. all these companies rallied because they were too cheap for an acquirer to pass up, which is why the buyer stocks rallied, of course, or too cheap versus the potential as was the case with the one-day gains in celgene and gilead. i searched why these gains are so elusive. until we know our tax situation and until we know what our benefits will be, we have to assume it makes more sense to sell than buy. in other words, the unknown, we're just presuming it's the worst of all. as long as this sword hangs over us, i'm confident of one thing. the near impossibility of making good money in the market as each day that goes by is another day where we have to worry that earnings will be light, that sales will be disappointing, and the consumer and the corporation are spooked into selling or sitting on their hands and freezing spending or firing workers. the bold companies will take advantage of this moment and
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make acquisitions. the speculative companies with no real economic sensitivity are free to go up. so many people are focused on locking in good gains now because they fear the tax on capital gains will rise next year. they want to get out before it happens including before a celgene or gilead can make you money. so here's the bottom line. we talk about rising above the fiscal cliff because only the unwillingness to compromise keeps us, you and me, from our goals. we on this network correctly identify that it is politics, not principle that is keeping our country from moving forward. that in turn is taking away from our ability to invest wisely for our future, for our kids, for school, otherwise these gains will be yours if you weren't so scared off not by the media but by washington and its inability to rise above which is keeping you from profiting from these fabulous moves we see every day in our stock market. i want to start with dave in maryland. dave? >> caller: jim cramer, i have a big whopping boo-yah from the chesapeake bay in maryland. >> well, man, i'm taking that
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stuttering boo-yah and throwing it right back at you. how can i help? >> caller: all right. look, i just read where bhp billiton is considering shipping some of their u.s. shale gas assets to asia. with the current push for energy independence in the u.s., would that even pass regulatory muster and what impact would that have on the stock price? >> a lot of people are feeling that epa will make it so that the only one that can export from here is cheniere lng. i don't think you'll be able to export. i think the government will stop it. tom in new york? tom? >> caller: boo-yah, jim, from new york. >> good to have you. >> caller: i've been hearing so much about true religion. where do you think they're headed? >> it's happening. you have to be on to the next one. that is for real. i'm looking for the next takeover play. but only one that has good fundamentals. how about charlie in washington state? charlie?
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[ busy tone ] >> wow, charlie sounds like one of those eagles plays i called in yesterday. yeah, it was my fault. the fiscal cliff is clouding judgment and overshadowing good investment opportunities. we have to keep the pressure on. and then we can go back to saving for our kids and retirement. "mad money" will be right back. >> coming up, penny for your thoughts? jcpenney has been on the retail hot seat while wall street speculated on its future with former apple executive ron johnson at the helm. but while one retailer struggles, cramer may have found one that's cleaning up. the big reveal is ahead. and later, red rising? concerns over a slowdown in china have hampered markets here at home. there are signs that could be changing. tonight, cramer is sifting through the facts to find the tough ways to play a potential turnaround in the people's republic.
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plus, trucking? westport innovations seemed out of gas after reporting last week. but then went into overdrive after the announcement it would be making engines for long-haul trucks. are hopes for our nat gas fueled future back on the table? find out in cramer's exclusive with the ceo. all coming up on "mad money."
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with the holidays rapidly approaching, black friday is right around the corner, we're about to reach that time of year where nothing is more important than shopping. although for me that is pretty much year round. so you think this will be a good moment to pick up some retailers. right now you have got to be
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real careful. as we see, retail can really be a hit or miss business. even on the low end with more value oriented stores that should be thriving in an environment where lots of people are worried about their taxes going up year end and the fiscal cliff is starting to get top of mind. you have a stock like walmart which has been a juggernaut, going up in a straight line since april until the recent pullback. then there is a company like -- sell, sell, sell. jcpenney. if you thought things couldn't get worse for jcpenney under the ceo, well, you were very wrong. as the company missed estimates once again on friday, reporting absolutely hideous numbers, they were blinding. sure enough, penney's continued the decline today, down another $2.67, 13%. like the wheel of fortune, where she stops, nobody knows. far more important, just so you know, there is a piece of preferred, there is another corporate piece of paper affiliated with jcpenney and that is sinking like a stone.
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that is more valuable to tell how bad things at jcpenney are. johnson tried to revolutionize by getting rid of coupons, cutting price as cross the board, they failed tragically and they started issuing coupons again. customers don't trust them. jc penney has tons of competition. how should you play this? i think you want to go with something that is not being torn apart by all sides, something that has a niche where they know how to execute. you want a chain that like the late great baseball player wee willie keeler hits them where they ain't. you want to own a high quality specialty store. if you are looking for one that works in the current environment, we had one of our favorite retail groups, sna, a
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company formerly known as dress barn. they told an incredible story. goofus. no story. gallant, real story. asena that doesn't dominate just one niche, they own a whole host of brands. the dominant players in multiple different categories. there is justice. there is justice. see, i told you. there's justice, a chain of 942 stores for tween girls. then there is maurice's, a place where they sell casual and dress apparel. dress barn. and then cina closed on charming shops which makes it the number one player in the plus size apparel market. that's a huge market considering that half of women in this country are size 14 and up. don't tell them that. the charming shop was too fast growing plus size chains. this transaction is a big reason why i've been a fan of the stock.
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we know that asina has a terrific track record of integrating acquisitions. that's what they did with maurice and justice. the initial guidance about the synergies from each deal turned out to be way too conservative. i think the same thing will happen with charming shops. isn't it interesting? jcpenney, the initial guidance way too aggressive. asina, initial guidance, conservative. that's what we want in a stock. the great thing about asina's business model is they're not hostage to any one brand or consumer. they have five different chains that have served multiple different niches and spreads out the risk. in other words, asina is diversified. something goes wrong in one chain, the other brand should be just fine. they have very little in common with each other. very little but not nothing. there is one thing all the asina's brands share. they have a focus on creating an enjoyable, enticing in store experience in each of the chains.
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in justice, they have bright colors, blaring music. they play videos of justice bieber. maurice, they put your name on the fitting room door. leaving places for your friends to sit. i need both of those when i'm shopping. dress barn is also about the service and relationships. this is a company that understands the special sauce, the x factor, what danny meyer said keeps people coming back. it shows in the results. asina understands the self-esteem factor. the best way to succeed is by making the customers feel good about themselves. something true for the tween shopper at justice and the plus size shoppers at lane bryant. the recent analyst data i referenced laid out the overall vision which is to create a family of leading retail concepts in $20 million in sales and top tier profitability. this year they're projecting
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five billion in sales. they think they can double that figure thanks to strong sales and e-commerce. i don't think the numbers are pie in the sky. i think they're legitimate. this is what causes a stock to double, everybody. when you have terrific management and multiple dominant concepts, sales seems doable and therefore a doubling of a stock. i think this stock is way too cheap. it sells for just 11 times earnings. it has a 15% long term growth rate. i'm used to seeing 16, 17 times earnings when i have that growth rate in retail. plus, we're still waiting for the synergies from the charming shops acquisition to kick in. as management is producing $50 million in overhead reductions over the next three years. they will consolidate distribution centers. the stock pulled back recently. it's now three points off the high. that is highly unusual for asina. i think it's worth snapping up right here. if you're looking for a value oriented retail winner going into the holidays and we all want one, right? i'll be worried about a lot of them, jcpenney and ross stores. i say look no further than
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asina, multiple niche concepts, fabulous understanding of what the customer wants, and i want you to think about this. like gilead, like celgene, like sherwin williams and the three other winners i mentioned at the top of the show, i'm presenting this in depth view because despite the fiscal cliff or even because of it, i think asina is going to be a winner. stay with cramer. coming up, red rising? concerns over a slowdown in china have hampered markets here at home. but there are signs that could be changing. tonight, cramer is sifting through the facts to find the top ways to play a potential turnaround in the people's republic. and later, trucking? westport innovations seemed out of gas after reporting last week. but then went into overdrive after the announcement it would be making engines for long haul trucks. are hopes for nat gas fuel future back on the table? find out in cramer's exclusive with the ceo all coming up on
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"mad money."
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three things have been weighing on this market. europe's terrible and getting worse. united states may be about to head over the fiscal cliff. and china, once the great engine of global economic growth, has been slowing.
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now, look, i can't solve all three of these problems tonight. actually in fact, i can't solve any of them. i can point to powerful evidence that one leg of the three legged stool of negativity is getting better. in short, i think the market is becoming too pessimistic about the little red book. i'm not talking about the one about investing. i'm talking about china. we have a host of positive data points and direct government actions aimed at stimulating the economy of the people's republic. but it seems like very few people in the west have noticed. i have to tell you, our big industrial stocks, they're trading at valuations that assume a depressed chinese economy, one that's not going to get any better. look, that's just wrong. it's not empirical. it's not rigorous. we just got some data overnight which showed that china's exports have climbed to a five-month high. that is not something you see from an economy that is about to crash and burn, is it? i'm not saying that china is fabulous and should be jumping for joy because of the state of
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their economic climate. but i am saying that the chinese negatives seem to be priced into all things china related. the chinese economy, i think, is in the process of bottoming. and based on what's been happening, i think it will have the kind of gentle, soft landing that very few investors, particularly the short sellers, are expecting. in other words, china is far from great. it's a heck of a lot better than the vast majority of people think. a lot of that is thanks to the chinese government. everybody's been waiting and waiting for the chinese authorities to pull out the big bazooka, some gigantic stimulus plan that would stop the slowdown in its tracks. no. the clever are very clever communist capitalists who run china never took out the bazooka. they never had a tony montana moment. they decided to turn the economy around with a bunch of smaller, more targeted interventions. little friends, so to speak. so far the chinese central bank has cut interest rates just twice.
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these guys have a lot more firepower to cut rates even further. they made three cuts to the reserve ratio that banks have been or are forced to have. which allows them to lend more aggressively. they had small targeted programs aimed at consumer business investment and helps stem the declining gdp. the real clue the is liquidity injections. the chinese central bank has been directly injecting cash into the economy in order to lower domestic borrowing costs and these injections have been accelerating. they had a $42 billion injection into the system. that is the second largest in history. this is two weeks after the largest ever injection which was 10% bigger. just two weeks later. for 15 consecutive weeks the chinese central back injected money directly aimed at stimulating growth. these injections got a lot less
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attention than a policy of more interest rate cuts. people keep saying where is that? where is that? they're doing it with injections. many u.s. investors, this whole change is flying under the radar. the important thing is the plan seems to be working. last thursday we got a raft of positive chinese data for october. industrial production rose by 9.6%. people were saying it's going to be at 7%. that's the biggest increase in five months. retail sales were up 14.5%. can you imagine if we had that? at the end of october we got a strong purchasing manager's report. hot rolled steel up is for ten straight days. iron ore is at its high. but the all important thing is that the chinese are doing this without causing any inflation. unlike the last time around. based on the latest numbers, they seem to have inflation whipped. they whipped inflation now to quote the late gerald ford.
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the latest consumer price index number was 1.7%. producer price index actually dropped by 2.8% in october. these are both down substantially from peak levels in summer of 2011. why are these inflation figures so crucial? china has been desperately trying to cool its overheated economy, get inflation under control. that is a big reason why they haven't pulled out big stimulus or cut interest rates really aggressively. they feared that would cause inflation to spike immediately. now china whipped the inflation problem, they have a lot more flexibility in terms of getting the economy going again. they just began the once every decade leadership transition. you better believe the new party bosses want to get the economy going again so they can win over the public. the political stakes in china are much higher than they are here. in america when you lose power, you get a job as a lobbyist. in china, they're not as kind to the odd party out. unlike our politicians, these guys have a real incentive to fix things.
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i wonder if they have three networks competing to call the election over there? anyway, yeah, china's better than you thought it was. yet many of our cyclical stocks that depend on china are still trading like the people's republic is going to have a really nasty, brutal, hard landing. based on what we're seeing, that is simply not in the cards which means the china oriented stocks deserve to go higher. forget the big picture for a second. you know i'm a bottoms up guy. i like to take my cue from individual companies. the companies with a lot of chinese business, they're saying the same thing. no one is listening. i'm listening. china stabilized. in late september caterpillar slashed its guidance but the stock didn't go down because people were expecting the worst. they said that china should improve in 2013 versus 2012. no wonder cat failed to go down today after a heavy duty downgrade from jp morgan this morning. of course, the analysts had upgraded it when china was
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slowing, a totally botched call. so you know what i'm doing? i'm calling this poetic tractor justice. eaton, another big industrial reported at the end of october. they noted that china was stabilizing. and then alcoa said that monetary policy in china would lead to improvement in the fourth quarter. the ceo of alcoa said that to me, said the fourth quarter is the bottom. you know what? he's looking real smart. he has horse sense. how about coach which has a big chinese business? they posted a 40% gain in china sales. both starbucks and yum brands which has substantial china guidance is outranking the chinese foodie that is general cho. so china stabilizing, if it's better than we think, how do you play it? my charitable trust is buying an index. the i shares china 25 index fund, the fxi. that's you home gamers, fxi. the highest quality china
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companies, china mobile, several chinese banks, petro china, huge oil companies and a couple insurance plays. if i'm right about the stabilization, the fxi should go higher, possibly much higher. it pays you to wait. what more can you ask for, honestly? the bottom line, the macro and the micro from individual companies that do business in china are saying the same thing. chinese economy is stabilizing right here. they have inflation whipped. 2013 should be better for the people's republic than 2012. china's small bore stimulus is working and the best way to play it is with the fxi. i'm going to ron in california right now. ron? >> caller: big boo-yah, too you, jim from south orange county, california. >> man, i love south orange county. i love the university system down there, too. i like irvine. >> caller: before i get started, i just want to say that we're thinking about you and your family and for that matter everybody in the studio audience and their family, hope everybody
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came out okay in that horrible storm. >> we got lucky. others are not. i know they appreciate your thoughts. thank you. >> caller: you're quite welcome. my question is pertaining to the chinese economic situation. what do you feel would be a better buy either las vegas sands or wynn resorts? >> i think that steve wynn is a winner. i don't say that to be, you know, glib. i think you want to own wynn here. i say that if it got to the mid 100s you got to pull the trigger. i can't back away now. steve in connecticut? >> caller: looking at u.s. domestic play, you did a segment in june, stock rallied and then reported earnings on october 24th, it seemed like the earnings were great. great guidance. but it took a 9.5% beat as of the next day. does the stock still have room to roll? >> i think it does. i was talking with stephanie link, the research director of there is a class of stocks that
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are up 50% or more. unless they blow away the numbers and get you to do a raise, they just don't go up. that's part of what's their problem. red bull? that's right. there may finally be a bull in the china shop. the macro says it. the micro says it. things are stabilizing. i think 2013 will be a very good year for china which is why in 2012 you have to buy the fxi. stay with cramer. coming up, trucking? westport innovations seemed out of gas after reporting last week. but then it went into overdrive after the announcement it would be making engines for long haul trucks. are hopes for nat gas fuel future back on the table? find out in cramer's exclusive with the ceo. and later, cliff diving? budget cuts, tax increases. the fiscal cliff looms large over the market. calls for compromise are out on all sides. but with gridlock still gripping the washington beltway, could
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your portfolio be at risk? stick around for cramer's call. all coming up on "mad money."
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it is time for the lightning round. you say the stock. play this sound and then the lightning round is over. are you ready? start the lightning round. i want to start with mason in new york. mason? >> caller: jim, big boo-yah from all of us here at penn state university. >> yes! go penn state. >> caller: me and my buddies are competing in a stock pick competition. we are thinking about the hotel industry. what is your idea on choice hotels? >> i don't want to be in the hotel industry right now. speaking of mason, i want to wish happy birthday to fiscal cliff mason who now turns 18. he's our head writer. all right. let's go to simon in florida. simon? >> caller: boo-yah from miami. >> oh, man. i wish i were there so bad. can you transport me there right now? what's the stock?
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>> caller: jim, i'd like to get your take on the largest holdings, marvel technology. >> i think that technology is being passed by. it is a very poorly run company. maybe the 3% yield helps it. i don't want anything to do with that stock. i would like to go to cody in michigan. cody? >> caller: boo-yah. >> wow. nice. >> i want to know what you think of ttc? >> yeah, it's a great housing play. it's a winner. i feel like it's going to continue to win. and let's go to carol in big missouri. carol? >> caller: boo-yah, jim! >> nice overtime win there, carol. what's up? >> caller: yeah, i'm wondering if you think alcoa aluminum is poised for a rebound in 2013. >> in 2013, yes. it does have tremendous tax law
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selling between now and year end. that is one horrible commodity that he has to deal with. it was like, you know, the copper corporation would be doing good. let's go to daniel in virginia. daniel? >> caller: yes? >> go ahead, daniel. you're up. >> caller: yep. >> you're up. >> caller: yeah, i'm wondering about ssys. >> stratus. yeah, that thing up is too much. that is a register ringer if i ever saw one. i don't want to be in a technology stock up 100%. i need to go right now to john in florida. john? >> caller: boo-yah, jimmy from the beach in miami! >> man, everyone is in a better place than i am. >> caller: i know, jim. listen, mark west energy. i know they did an offering after the bell today. they got hit. what's going on? >> stephanie link, our research director, and my best super forensic accountant, we're all bemoaning what a time for this deal to come. it is going to kill the stock. it's going to drive it to 7%.
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this group is too hard to own. maybe didn't get mwe which we did like at $45. that's the level. nothing above it. and that, ladies and gentlemen, is the conclusion of the lightning round. >> the lightning round is sponsored by td ameritrade. it's a brutal full contact sport. >> from the time the whistle blows, traders bracing for what could turn out to be a wild session. >> the last play of the game. >> markets absolutely getting hammered today. >> i know it's not easy. but i promise to keep fighting for you. >> jim cramer, leveling the playing field for all. >> the road is a tough one. but the payoff can be your greatest win of all. >> join "mad money's" training , scuba diving the great barrier reef with sharks, or jumping into the market, he goes with people he trusts,
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which is why he trades with a company that doesn't nickel and dime him with hidden fees. so he can worry about other things, like what the market is doing and being ready, no matter what happens, which isn't rocket science. it's just common sense, from td ameritrade. if we want to improve science. our schools... ... what should we invest in? maybe new buildings? what about updated equipment? they can help, but recent research shows... ... nothing transforms schools like investing in advanced teacher education. let's build a strong foundation. let's invest in our teachers so they can inspire our students. let's solve this. side by side so you get the same coverage, often for less. that's one smart board. what else does it do, reverse gravity? [ laughs ] [ laughs ] [ whooshing ]
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tell me about it. why am i not going anywhere? you don't believe hard enough. a smarter way to shop around. now that's progressive. call or click today. [ grunting ] ♪ ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] don't just reject convention. drown it out. introducing the all-new 2013 lexus ls f sport. an entirely new pursuit. why they have a raise your rate cd. tonight our guest, thomas sargent. nobel laureate in economics, and one of the most cited economists in the world. professor sargent, can you tell me
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what cd rates will be in two years? no. if he can't, no one can. that's why ally has a raise your rate cd. ally bank. your money needs an ally. that makes watching tv even better. if your tv were a hot dog zeebox would be some sort of fancy, french mustard. when they magically unite, people would think, "woah, this two dollar hot dog tastes like a fancy eight dollar hot dog." download zeebox free, and say "woah" every time you watch tv. camp weeknights. natural gas vehicles, something i've been advocating for years. nat gas is a cleaner, cheaper
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alternative to petroleum and far more domestically abundant. we could create jobs and build out the infrastructure for nat gas economy. seems like a no-brainer. the legislation to provide incentives for the switch to natural gas has been tied up in congress for ages. with president obama's relection last week, it could be four more years before this happens. since the president hasn't done a thing to promote this cleaner, more abundant fuel that is, well, let's just put it this well, it's certainly a lot better than importing diesel which brings me to west it is port innovations. they make the technology that allows engines to run on natural gas. they have the best tech in the business. the world's top engine maker and another with caterpillar. westport stock has been savaged over the last couple months. the company preannounced disappointing results at the end of october. last wednesday it got hit by a sell initiation from goldman
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sachs, brutal. the very next day reported a larger than expected loss. after getting pounded down to the low 20s, they rebounded on friday. rallied more than 9%. the company announced they would start producing the first long haul truck engine next year. that can be a sign that maybe things bottomed. long term the stock has given us a double since i first got behind it in january 2010. but now it's down 28% since the last time we spoke with the ceo in august. has westport been punished enough? they initiated coverage with a sell rating. had the expectations come down enough that the risk/reward is now in your favor? let's check in with david demers, the founder and ceo of westport innovations. find out how his company is doing and where it's headed. welcome back to "mad money." >> jim, good to be back. >> in all the conference calls that you -- that i've heard you be on, and all the statements i've seen you put out, this one
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seemed to be the most fated, so to speak, meaning that it just didn't seem that westport can be in control of its own destiny given all the things that have to occur to accelerate the buildout of natural gas vehicles. >> i'm sorry to hear you say that. we were certainly trying to come across as being very bullish on where things have gone and how much progress we made. remember, this is an enormous, enormous industry. we're disrupting the two biggest industries in the world. we're disrupting the oil and gas business and the fuel business and then on the other hand, we have the vehicle business. so, yeah, we're moving into a new era from, you know, when we're doing a bunch of work the last decade and proving the concept, now it's really serious. things are happening. we have to coordinate enormous investment and partners to make this happen. but have no doubt, it's going to happen. this is where i get this. i hope it's clear that no vehicle under new fuel can operate without fuel stations.
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and where that natural gas and traditional oil and gas or unconventional gas such as coal bed, methane or biogas, we have to get this organized and it has to be, here's the key word because i know it isn't, coordinated. there is nothing in our country about coordination of natural gas. >> yeah. i think the challenge is not government. we've had this debate before, jim. i think the problem with government programs, yeah, you can get a great lift. if you don't get it right in the front, it's a bit toxic to the growth of the industry. i think we're past it now. i really do. it would have been great two or three years ago to get things kicked off. we're at the point now where the idea is really well embedded. you know, we have pretty classic behavior in the marketplace, too. we had some early adopter customers, people tried it in and out in various industries. we have done buses and wreckage trucks and now long haul and
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getting into mining trucks. people are really quite engaged in this. it's going to happen. it has to be coordinated. we're in the middle of the production, supply chain, fuel guys, everyone's coming to talk to us. we can see the picture that's happening. and, yeah, it may not be quite as visible to the general public and certainly you don't see it from the quarterly numbers, but on the long trend if you look back where we've come and you project where we're going, there is not much doubt. we're very confident that we don't need government incentives today. it would be nice to see a little more support maybe or recognition. but it's going to happen without it. >> here we are on page 14 of the conference call. you say, i mean what has really happened in china is that the government has declared natural gas for trucking as a priority. so in china government is good. in our country, government doesn't matter? >> well, china's got different problems. and with all respect, you know, china has got a terrible energy
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problem. they import even more oil than north america and they've discovered now that they do have natural gas shales. they have more shale resources than we do here. yeah, the government can get organized. they own the energy industry. the energy business has been developing natural gas infrastructure very quickly because they've got some certainty. in this country, certainty is hard to come by these days. lots of uncertainty. i think that we're going to see continued kind of ups and downs as people look at should we be investing billions of dollars in infrastructure until the products are there? of course, the automotive guys are going, wow, we can't invest in new product until we see the fuel or the fuel stations. so, yeah, it's a bit of back and forth here. i'm convinced that it's going to be a very robust transition to have natural gas here and in other parts of the world. china is ahead. but we'll catch up. >> all right. the linked quarter was not good.
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do you that linked quarter decline will be stemmed by the fact that you have long haul engines coming out in 2013 that might turn the momentum around for the quarterly numbers? >> yeah. i think we're caught a bit because last year third and fourth quarter were great growth quarters. you probably remember that. they were great quarters. and finished the year really nicely. so comparing year over year, the growth has not been there except that if you look at our year to date, we're up 30% which is our historical growth factor. i think that really what we're in a bit of a pause right now for the economics, for transition, for some specific customer situations. but we have a whole raft of new products hitting us next year particularly in the long haul business. i think that's going to inevitably raise revenue next year. so, yes, it's a little disappointing we didn't see the growth this year and you know, we're making no bones about it. we're surprised that it hasn't picked up. but it's just pushed out into next year, i think. >> all right, david.
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thank you for that candid assessment of how things are going at westport innovations. good to see you, sir. thank you for coming on "mad money." >> sure. thanks, jim. >> that is david demers, ceo and founder of westport innovations. next year long haul, that could make the difference. "mad money" is back after the break. coming up, cliff diving? budget cuts, tax increases. the fiscal cliff looms large over the market. calls for compromise are out on all sides. but with gridlock still gripping the washington beltway, could your portfolio be at risk? stick around for cramer's call.
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what forces the hands of congress and the president to make a budget deal before taxes shoot up and spending slams down? what inputs do they need in washington to avoid $600 billion in immediate tax increases on january 1st, 2013? i see three pressure points. the first could be a precipitous decline in the stock market. we have two precedents for the market to matter, the t.a.r.p. vote and deal in europe. after t.a.r.p. failed in congress, the market took a hammering. sellers knew they had to get out before the banking system collapsed. it may take a failed vote and then a market collapse before we get a real deal. there is no secret when the european central bank had the first breakthrough. the bank stocks looked like they would be rolled into oblivion. we may have to repeat that decline here, too, to get things done. the second pressure point, the beginning of a rapid increase in jobless claims.
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this is what i most fear. everyone from the biggest executives to the smallest of small businessmen knows it is time to fire. why not? we rewarded executives who saw it coming first and fired people quickly the last time around at the beginning of the great recession. their stocks were the first to rebound. they were rewarded financially. those who fired fastest did best. you'll see these firings show up in the jobless claims on thursday which will grow steadily worse the longer we go without a deal being brokered. do they care in washington about the jobless claims? i wish they did. third pressure point, in order to stop the fiscal cliff jump, ceos who contributed to the romney campaign have to recognize that policies they backed including no compromise with democrats did not and are not going to succeed. sorry. that's what that election meant. they must switch their firepower, directing it towards those who would work on compromise, republican or democrat, to prevent the cliff jump. they're starting to do that now
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with ad campaigns to get a deal done. that is extremely hopeful. after all, these are money men. the previous strategy of doing nothing cost them big. it's rational they put the big lobbying and ad dollars behind those who want to compromise rather than those who want to sink, blow, and stand on principle that could drive us into recession by early 2013. now that's a principle. to me, the clock is ticking. the democrats have to show the diehard republicans that a strategy of protecting the rights of rich people including hedge funds and private equity fund managers to pay lower taxes is a loser that could get them thrown out of office. the republicans have to show the democrats there must be real entitlement cuts if the job is going to get done once and for all. these are tall orders. right now the market by not going down today is saying there could be a deal. i just think that while a deal makes sense, we may first need more pain in the form of lower markets and subpar hiring before anything important can be agreed upon. stick with cramer.
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